Y4iT 2008 Experience: Day 1 – “…and no, Firefox is NOT a freeware.”

This is the first day of the Y4iT event, and I was there as a volunteer for my organization, UnPLUG. I was assigned along with other fellow members and other org volunteers on the Registration Committee. We started our day with the bulk of delegates pouring on our site for registration and claiming of ID’s – their proof that they were already paid.

Around 10:15 I decided to listen to the talk of Ms. Mikaela Fudolig about why she uses Windows. Actually, the title of her talk was “Why I use Windows: The Main Problem of Linux from the Consumers’ Point of View.”

I thought I will be hearing an intelligent, witty, or at least well-researched talk on the merits and demerits of both OS, but I was greatly disappointed; I was expecting more from Ms. Fudolig.

Before I proceed, I would like to point out that I was a Windows user since I learned how to use a computer. I am using Windows for a decade now, though I rarely boot it up; most of the time I use it to use certain specialized applications that doesn’t still have a satisfactory alternative working under Linux. The things that I will write below will not be influenced by the fact that I am a FOSS advocate nor I am already a Linux convert for a year. I believe that Microsoft is a superb research company; their research on user experience and usability of applications is very, to the lack of better term at the moment, cool.

Ms. Fudolig’s talk can be summarized by the this statement: The main problem of Linux is its not user-friendly.

I will not go to the definition of user-friendliness, or usability, both of which are situational or contextual, and highly subjective.

If Ms. Fudolig did her homework, she would find out that by now, several Linux distributions are not only usable for the general public, some of them even surpassed Windows in terms of intuitiveness and aesthetics, not to mention use of computer resources. Her experience of Mandrake was legitimate, but her concerns were trivial. Several people I know who are not computer geeks nor IT professionals didn’t find it hard as she did. I even knew some people who pretty much abandoned Windows completely for Mandrake, and Mandrake by today’s standards on the Linux world is not that “user-friendly” yet. The solutions to her “command line” problems were pretty straightforward, provided she changed her mindset and stop comparing Linux to Windows. There is some surprising discovery here: Linux is NOT Windows.

Which brings me to the most important point I want to raise: This world is an illusion, it is called the Matrix and was created to keep us asleep so that the machines can harvest us for energy. No, what I meant is that the concept of user-friendliness and usability Ms. Fudolig was talking about was biased. Underneath her talk was an assumption that the standard for user-friendliness is Windows, and Linux, since it is not Windows, should look more like Windows to be usable. Studies show that things people consider as user-friendly are not that user-friendly at all, they are just more familiar with it so they prefer it more. Since most of us had our first PC’s installed with Windows , it is inevitable that it is the OS we are mostly familiar with. People like Ms. Fudolig confuse this familiarity with user-friendliness. Say your first OS is a Linux, or even a Unix, you would also consider Windows weird.

I would like to point out some of the things in her talk but since I need to get up early tomorrow I’ll just enumerate my reactions to some of her points. Hopefully I would be able to expand on these later.

> She said that Windows has a “superior” support over Linux due to the presence of a help file, and the send error report thingy. Ms. Fudolig, take it from us who spent more time with Windows: Most of the time that “support” won’t help you with your serious problems. Linux on the other hand, has a very large community of developers that can answer and address your problems within days or even minutes, provided your problem was not asked by another guy on the internet, which basically means you don’t have to ask anymore, just search for it.

> Firefox is not a freeware. A freeware is by definition free in terms of price. Most of the time there is only one developer. Support is scarce and is limited most of the time to that developer. Finally, the source code of the freeware is not necessarily shared by the developer, and hence not free in the sense of “freedom” to modify it. In contrast, Firefox, and Linux for that matter, are called Open-Source software. They can be free but they are not necessarily free in monetary terms. They are free in the sense that anyone can modify the program based on their needs, since the source code is open or shared by developers. Most of the time there are several developers and there is an active community on these applications or OS.

I do know some of the limitations of Linux over Windows, and frankly, I don’t mind someone criticizing its weaknesses. But let’s stick on the facts shall we?

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~ by rosmant on September 2, 2008.

26 Responses to “Y4iT 2008 Experience: Day 1 – “…and no, Firefox is NOT a freeware.””

  1. I think the problem here is who got Fudolig to be a speaker? I think you should grill that guy/gal because they should have picked an expert on the field.

    In terms of Windows vs. Linux thing, I think linux is getting more friendlier now than before. I used Red Hat when I was in university and thought it was very good until I got my hands on ubuntu now. And hardware requirements too, is what made me shift all the way to linux (debian). While Vista nowadays requires “at least” 1 gb RAM, Ubuntu’s 1 Gb is overkill. Its faster and virtually almost all softwares are free.

    In fairness to Windows, btw, your take about their research for usability and user experience is very true. Very streamlined and well thought off.

  2. I thought the title of her talk was…”Why I Use Windows:
    The Main Problem with Linux from the Consumer’s Point of View” ?

  3. Yes, I stand corrected. Thanks for pointing it out.

  4. “I think the problem here is who got Fudolig to be a speaker? I think you should grill that guy/gal because they should have picked an expert on the field.”

    Getting an expert for the topic would have defeated the purpose of the talk (based on the title).

    They should have instead changed the title from “Consumer’s Point of View” to a “Window’s User Point of View”.

  5. Hello, Rosmant!

    My name is Mikaela Fudolig, and you were just talking about me. I don’t know what the fuss is all about. My point is that, if Linux were so usable, WHY AREN’T MOST PEOPLE SHIFTING TO IT, despite its potential?

    Maybe it’s because IT experts refuse to listen to buyers, who are NOT IT geeks.

    Regarding my speaking on the topic, I did not pretend to be an IT expert — I had said that in the beginning of my talk, and I had informed the organizers about that. All I wanted to do was to share something from the outside of the IT expert’s world that perhaps, they do not see.

    And regarding Firefox, and whether it is freeware or not, that is not my point. What I said was that Linux could be another Firefox, if only developers listened to what the non-IT experts (which comprise majority of the world) need. I didn’t think that hurt.

    Regarding familiarity, isn’t that one aspect of usability? Thus, if Linux became more familiar, wouldn’t people find it easier to shift to it?

    Linux could still be better – it has not yet reached its peak. I hope this clarifies things.

  6. The following is not for the faint of heart. I am very harsh and frank when giving comments, especially in posts like this.

    My name is Mikaela Fudolig, and you were just talking about me. I don’t know what the fuss is all about. My point is that, if Linux were so usable, WHY AREN’T MOST PEOPLE SHIFTING TO IT, despite its potential?

    —> Sa tingin ko, isa sa mga minimithi ng blog entry na ito ay ipaliwanag at palawakin ang kaalaman ng mga taong babasa nito. Kung magsasalita ka at ayaw mong may magkumento sa mga sasabihin mo, o ‘di kaya’y ang gusto mo lamang ay ang mga taong sasang-ayon sa iyo, mas mabuti na manahimik na lamang. “It is better to be silent and considered a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.” Mayroon bang insecurity na nararamdaman? Maaaring mayroon dahil sa “I don’t know what the fuss is all about.” (i could edit the last 2 sentences out)

    Maybe it’s because IT experts refuse to listen to buyers, who are NOT IT geeks.

    —> If IT experts refused to listen to buyers, what would happen to our world? Yes, a lot of consumers are not IT geeks. But you don’t need to be an IT geek to learn. Ano ba talaga, kailangan bang IT geek ka to use it, or is this just the issue of usability? Kapag ba hindi usable yung software, IT geek lang ang makakagamit nito?

    Regarding my speaking on the topic, I did not pretend to be an IT expert — I had said that in the beginning of my talk, and I had informed the organizers about that. All I wanted to do was to share something from the outside of the IT expert’s world that perhaps, they do not see.

    —> Actually, they do see that. The problem is when people (like you) don’t research enough to find out more about a certain topic. I was expecting more from you, given your credentials. Honestly, parang report ng high school yung talk n’ya. Mababaw. I know that she’s not an expert in this field, and neither am I. I’m a Philosophy Major, but I always try to do my best when it comes to research.

    And regarding Firefox, and whether it is freeware or not, that is not my point. What I said was that Linux could be another Firefox, if only developers listened to what the non-IT experts (which comprise majority of the world) need. I didn’t think that hurt.

    —> They are listening. They do make software that non-IT users need. The problem lies with the users. Andyan nga yung program, ayaw naman gamitin dahil mababa ang usability. Pero ano ba itong usability na ito?

    Regarding familiarity, isn’t that one aspect of usability? Thus, if Linux became more familiar, wouldn’t people find it easier to shift to it?

    —> Familiarity and usability. How do you define these two words? Kasi kung familiarity and usability in the Microsoft Windows sense, you’re saying na dapat maging parang Windows yung Linux, in the sense na yung environment, applications, etc., ay parang sa Windows na rin. Isipin mo ‘to: Kapag pinanganak ka sa Spain, ceteris paribus, most probably ang wika mo ay Espanyol. Kung sa Pilipinas, Pilipino. Kasi dun ka masasanay. Kung ang isang taong walang alam sa mga OS, software, etc. ay matututo ng Linux, aba, pag nakakita ng Windows yun baka ibato n’ya yung computer. Ganun kasi yung nangyayari. Dahil sa Windows tayo nasanay, ayaw na nating lumipat – it works e. Pinipilit nating maging Windows ang Linux kasi dun tayo sanay. Hindi tayo sanay na gumalaw sa Linux environment dahil nasanay na tayong gumamit ng Windows.

    MISC.

    About Error Reports in Microsoft:

    Microsoft receive first ever Error Report
    There were scenes of jubilation at the headquarters of Mircrosoft in Richmond, Washington yesterday, when the first Microsoft user clicked on the ‘send’ button after reading the Error Message.

    Norman Windlesham’s version of Word on Windows XP had been running trouble-free for nearly two hours when it unexpectedly froze, losing a short article about Edward the Second that he had been writing for an amateur history magazine.

    ‘Just out of curiosity I clicked on the ‘Send Error Report’ icon rather ‘Don’t Send’ like I normally do,’ said Mr Windlesham from his home in Purley. ‘But I never expected to hear back from them. Imagine my excitement when I got a message back almost instantly from Bill Gates himself. I was absolutely delighted!’ The message reads: ‘Thank God there’s someone out there! For the last ten years we thought everyone was deliberately ignoring us! Stay there – don’t move!’

    A crack squad of six highly-trained XPerts ™ was immediately dispatched, arriving at Mr Windlesham’s house the following day, only to find that Mr Windlesham had turned his PC off and then on again, and the problem seemed to have gone away. ‘They looked very disappointed. Especially when I said I was thinking of getting an iBook anyway.’

    from: http://newsbiscuit.com/article/microsoft-receive-first-error-report-178

    Wow, gaano na katagal ang SEND ERROR REPORT ng XP? (This happened in 2007). Talk about SUPERIOR SUPPORT. I’ve tried using the XP help walkthrough many times and every time it lead me to nowhere.

    About Mandriva:

    She mentioned that she used Mandriva a long time ago. Kung Win98 ang OS nila dati, malamang, hindi nasatisfy yung system requirements ng Mandriva, kaya mabagal at hindi kinakaya ng system. Traumatic siguro yung experience.

    About Fudolig as speaker:

    IMHO, the problem is WHY she was chosen to be a speaker. Biased na kasi s’ya e. May past experience na kasi s’ya with Linux, at panget pa yung experience na ‘yun.

    Last na. Saan galing o sino ang may sabi na aspect ng usability ang familiarity? (citation needed)

  7. Hi Mikki,

    Thanks for your response. It did help that you clarified some of the points you raised on your talk.

    Mikki: I don’t know what the fuss is all about.

    Me: I believe I’ve stated my points on my post. No need to repeat it here.

    Mikki: My point is that, if Linux were so usable, WHY AREN’T MOST PEOPLE SHIFTING TO IT, despite its potential?

    Me: Well, there are several reasons.

    First is that a lot of PC’s already have Windows installed on them. For an average user, installing an OS amounts to, say, a double heart bypass surgery. Plus the fact that the OS installed wasn’t free; its price was integrated to the price of that PC. Why would I delete an OS that I already paid for?

    Second, and I believe this is clear when you asked the delegates about Linux: Most of them didn’t even know it exists.

    Third, those who do know Linux exists were misinformed that Linux is hard to use, that only computer geeks know how to use it.

    Fourth, the point you raised. Most people learn how to use a computer through Windows (see argument 1). Because of this, Windows User Interface became their standard when faced with a novel OS such as Linux. Familiarity is equated with ease of use. Read this:
    http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070605-product-loyalty-consumers-mistake-familiarity-with-superiority.html

    Mikki: Maybe it’s because IT experts refuse to listen to buyers, who are NOT IT geeks.

    Me: I am a psych major. A certain former president of a Linux User Group here in Metro Manila is a Library Science Student. A particular professor in the Philosophy department thrives first in Mandrake, then Linux Mint. The one who posted above says he’s a Philo major. I know several people in various colleges who use Linux and recently abandoned Windows. Go to my favorite tambayan at the moment (read: Burger King SM North) and see several people using Ubuntu.

    My point is that it doesn’t take an IT Geek to use Linux. All you need to do is accept the fact Linux is not Windows. Linux is Linux. Usability is not equal to Windows.

    Mikki: Regarding my speaking on the topic, I did not pretend to be an IT expert — I had said that in the beginning of my talk, and I had informed the organizers about that. All I wanted to do was to share something from the outside of the IT expert’s world that perhaps, they do not see.

    Me: Actually, as I have stated above, I don’t mind people criticizing its weaknesses. What I was concerned about is that you presented your talk without first considering the recent advances in Linux Usability. Some of the points you’ve raised were now nonexistent. And though you assured the audience that your not an authority in this field, you forgot your status and fame. Your credibility gave weight to some of these points and as a result, we have a thousand delegates misinformed about Linux.

    Mikki: And regarding Firefox, and whether it is freeware or not, that is not my point.

    Me: Me too. I just used that title. And the issue between a ‘freeware’ and ‘open-source software / free software’ is I think important.

    Mikki: What I said was that Linux could be another Firefox, if only developers listened to what the non-IT experts (which comprise majority of the world) need.

    Me: Apparently, Firefox resulted from the same philosophy that brought us Linux. Firefox strength is not that it is similar to Internet Explorer, but rather it tries to attract users by promoting the superiority of its technology in its own way. Hence the tabs and all. Linux also tries to be like that. Rather than reinventing Windows, it is promoting its own superior technology and usability.

    Mikki: I didn’t think that hurt.

    Me: Huh?

    Mikki: Regarding familiarity, isn’t that one aspect of usability? Thus, if Linux became more familiar, wouldn’t people find it easier to shift to it?

    Me: Again, familiarity for most people means “like windows.” Please see the link I posted above. And no, familiarity is not an aspect of usability: http://www.utexas.edu/academic/diia/assessment/iar/glossary.php

    Although familiarity does imply convenience, in usability ease of use is more of comes from design.

    Mikki: Linux could still be better – it has not yet reached its peak. I hope this clarifies things.

    Me: Yes. And it is what’s exciting about it: many people now believe Linux is superior, and it hasn’t reached the apex yet.

    Regarding to one of the points you raised about the redundancy of applications in Linux, describing it as “magulo” or chaotic, I believe this is a matter of opinion. The presence of several programs can be perceived as magulo or as freedom of choice.

    Regards,
    rosmant

  8. People, people. Listen to the message, don’t shoot the messenger.

    The point of the talk was to inform experts how consumers can know so little about a product, or how a great product can be actually “useless” (note the quotes) to a consumer. It was not to persuade you that Linux is unusable. It was to tell you that Linux was unusable – to her. For that to come from one of the more celebrated brains in recent years should be a wake-up call to anyone who wants to accelerate the Linux “uprising” into a Linux “revolution”.

    As any successful seller of products or ideas knows, the customer is always right.

    Really, all great companies spend tons and tons of money just to pry consumers for their opinion. I know, I was in market research for sometime and worked with a number of multinationals and local firms. Sus! did you know that we even had to count the number of scrubs a labandera made for each garment just so the detergent company can adjust the formulation so the laundry bar could deliver cleaning at equal or fewer scrubs? Di lang yun, the bar had to have the optimum amount and size of bubbles so the housewife or laundry-husband is satisfied that the product is working. And did you know that bubbles are not really synonymous to cleaning? I know that, too, because I was R&D manager of two major laundry detergent/soap brands for sometime.

    But hey, even if we had the ultimate laundry formula, what good would it be if only the chemists bought it because only they could understand the formulation and the right conditions this formula would work in? Product instructions have to be simple and comprehensible so the user doesn’t have to ask the grand community of expert labanderas when the white shirt isn’t as white, or the green shirt turned blue… whatever.

    When we introduced Tide Ultra to the Philippines, the product had to be reformulated to work within the context of laundry habits, and within the constraints of environmental laws on detergent materials prevailing here at the time. The US version of the product worked well in the US where people used washing machines and heated their washing water. It wouldn’t work here where we handwashed (product would have cleaned well and hurt a lot of skin) and used cold water for washing machines. We did see that a lot of women soaked their laundry or made “kula” and figured out a way to make the formula that would ride on these habits.

    You will not believe the money spent just to find out about this particular habit (why babad? why kula? how long? kinds of dirt addressed, colors of garments that underwent the process). But that tells you how important the consumer is to this company (and to its competitors).

    The resulting product ultimately had to compete with laundry bars, soaps, and powders in 1 year of field and market testing involving thousands of housewives before it could enter mass production and marketing. I know. I supervised that grand study.

    About 20 years later, Tide condensed granules, the first of its kind in the country, is still around, with a decent market share in this crowded market. Consumer habits have evolved from handwash with soaking to washing machines with soaking and we never had to convince consumers to change from cold to hot water.

    Lesson: work with the consumer. Work with the consumer. Know what he/she wants or needs, and start from there.

    Microsoft has at last seen the light, and started to address its biggest problem (yes, even if it is the leader): price. By segmenting the market by its needs (some use only a part of the Windows and Office software all the time), it is now offering several options for its product at different price levels. And if the same can be realized by Corel or Adobe, or SPSS, there would be less business opportunities in Greenhills – ah I suppose you know what I mean.

    But you may belittle laundry as too mundane. So let me get into something that could be closer to your hearts: laptops and hard disks. A very small community among us knows which brands have the best hard disks, mainly because these manufacturers demand prime quality hard disks. We know where the best hard disks are made, how they are made. Some of us (not me) would tell you how some features of laptops are overdesigned for the structure, or why some of the keys of the keyboard could possibly fall off. I could tell you why one laptop model, a pretty decent one, had to be phased out because of the position of its USBs, or how the location of the speakers was not ergonomic. However, ultimately, what hardware experts know don’t matter as much as what buyers experience, want, or need. Buyers might not do research – they can’t be bothered to do that – they just don’t buy again if the product they bought didn’t deliver. A product is only as good as the last experience.

    I could go on and on, but the same mantra of marketing is applicable to any product, service, or idea competing in an open arena. Consumers, consumers, and consumers rule.

    So I wouldn’t knock Ms. Fudolig for her message. Demeaning her for “not doing research” or “not being an expert” is in bad taste. (She doesn’t demean people for not being able to get a “2.0” or higher in Physics or Math, or who can’t write a scientific paper, or who are still in college at 17.) If she did her “research”, she wouldn’t have been an expert consumer.

    By the way, is anyone thinking of software which are friendly to older people? Older people have money to pay for convenience and ease of use. I know. I am old. Truly.

  9. Mikaela Fudolig? Is that her? I know she has more tons of knowledge and brain cells than me but is that a witty statement from her regarding Linux and Microsoft? Oh, I see it’s witty bias.

    I have used Microsoft Windows XP since I was in Freshman in highschool and shifted to Vista after I got my laptop last summer. Microsoft windows is such a good operating system. At parang yun na ang naging official OS ng buhay ko. But I switched to linux. At first, wala. Parang di pa din ako maligawan ng Linux. As in I thought of not letting go Windows kahit anong mangyari.

    Going back to Ms. Fudolig’s post.

    *My name is Mikaela Fudolig, and you were just talking about me. I don’t know what the fuss is all about. My point is that, if Linux were so usable, WHY AREN’T MOST PEOPLE SHIFTING TO IT, despite its potential?*

    Oooh.. If I am not mistaken, Linux runs 85% of the world’s fastest computer?(Try typing it on your search box) Di ko nga alam kasi kahit ako na Linux user di makapaniwala na ganun kalaki na pala ang gumagamit ng Linux. The only problem is, HINDI KA LANG SANAY. Sabi nga ni Neo, parang linggwahe lang yan, lumaki kang Pilipino, natural sa salitang Pilipino ka sanay. It would be too uncomfortable kung gagamit ka ng japanese or chinese kahit pa sabihin mong mas maganda kung alam mo din tong mga linggwahe na to lalo na kung sa China at Japan ka mag aabroad dahil maganda dun ang sahod. Parang OS lang yan. Mag aadapt ka lang naman eh. Yun lang yun.
    Charge it to my experience, bakit ako nag linux? Kasi halos mag crash na yung laptop ko sa Vista. Masyadong malaki yung sakop niya at grabe ang bagal. Panu pa nung nilagyan ko ng Adobe Package? Halos di ko na mabuksan yung laptop samantalang anlaki ng ram niya, hard drive and im using one of the latest graphics card. How could that happen? Vista, I can say, possess a great quality graphics, features, applications, etc. pero, baka siya ang hindi user-friendly. Nag focus lang siya sa quality pero panu yung ease na di ka mahihirapan talaga. Nadisappoint ako dun. I switched back to XP and not less than a minute, I formatted my laptop again to my huge disappointment. As in, what the heck. What’s the use of switching back to XP. Balik Vista for I HAVE NO CHOICE. Kahit nahihirapan na ko. Take note: Windows Baby ako. Until I switched to Linux. At first, di ko pa rin matanggap na I am using Linux dahil sira na yung vista. Dahil sa huge disappointment ko, ayoko na magtiwala sa kahit ano pa mang OS. Pero nagkamali ako. I adapted to Linux for as short as three days. Ginawan din ng linux ko ng sariling driver yung sound card na months kong hindi magawa sa Vista at di na rin nasolusyonan ng HP Compaq Philippines. And I found ease. Sobra. Quality? Of course, it satisfied me. Kasi ayon sa gusto ko yung pagkakacustomize ng OS WHICH YOU CANNOT APPLY in Vista. As in lahat. Oo, sasabihin ng iba na, walang consistent quality and one sturdy concept ang Linux. But have you tried to see kung bakit ganun ang linux? Ikaw Ms. Fudolig? Pareho ba tayo? Interest mo, sa interest ko? Fine Arts ako and I prefer only Studio than anything else. Kasi yun ang field ko. Ganun din ang Linux. Based on your taste, need and how you want it to be. Di lahat ng tao gusto ang iisang concept lang. They want to build their own. Which I found on linux. At pwede pa combinations. Siguro kung gagamit ka ng Ubuntu Studio, malamang, binato mo na yung computer mo dahil as in super total no connection to you yung concept ng Ubuntu studio.
    I want to tell you one thing more. If MOST people aren’t shifting to Linux, bakit ako na starter pa lang sa LINUX WORLD for maybe a couple of months or three, bakit lahat ng nakaranas ng paggamit na laptop ko wanted to switch to linux? I have a branch of University who are asking to introduce linux to them dahil lang sa isang student na nagtanong if they can have another insentive aside from windows na sinagot ko lang na, “Why don’t you give Linux a try?”. After the student’s experience, ngayon, they(the ubiversity) wanted to make Linux as their official OS.
    Sabi nga ng prof ko nung makita niya na linux ang gamit ko, tinanong niya ko kung bakit yun ang gamit ko (in the middle of our presentation with projector). Di pa ko nakakasagot, sinabi niya, “that’s better than vista. I hated vista. Mas naapreciate ko pa ang XP. Andun nga lahat ng kagandahan, di ka naman lang makagamit ng maayos ng matagal. At super bagal.”

    And don’t you get also one of the important concept why Linux was made? Para magamit ng lahat ng tao. And you know what, that’s one big step to avoid SOFTWARE piracy and stealing. Why? Di naman lahat nakakaafford nun eh. And alam kong kaya mong palawakin yan sa utak mo no need to explain.

    I know biased na ko.. Hindi ako avocate ng Linux. I just want to tell you Young Ms. Fudolig, what I said is NOT WHAT I BELIEVE, but what I DISCOVERED as a truth not just from me but from others’ experiences. Which if you cannot accept as a FACT from me, then why don’t you find and discover it for yourself.

    Simple. You’re experience is not enough to describe a consumers’ perspective as a WHOLE.

    And please don’t say it according to what you see. Remember. Nasa Pilipinas ka pa lang. And you haven’t seen the whole yet. Kahit nga ako, HINDI PA RIN MAKAPANIWALA. Most of people are using Linux NA PALA.

  10. Whoa… Is there a superiority complex here…?

    People, people. Listen to the message, don’t shoot the messenger.

    —> What I am getting is that the messenger has nothing to do with the message he or she is conveying. It doesn’t matter if you’re a public figure or not, tama ba?

    As a speaker, the audience think that you know what you are saying. You are not only a consumer, you, being a person of authority, represent the consumers.

    The point of the talk was to inform experts how consumers can know so little about a product, or how a great product can be actually “useless” (note the quotes) to a consumer. It was not to persuade you that Linux is unusable. It was to tell you that Linux was unusable – to her. For that to come from one of the more celebrated brains in recent years should be a wake-up call to anyone who wants to accelerate the Linux “uprising” into a Linux “revolution”.

    —> Yes, and for that to come from one of the more celebrated brains in recent years, it was also saying that Linux is unusable – period. Argumentum Ad Verecundiam – appeal to authority. Just because someone in authority said so, everyone should follow.

    As any successful seller of products or ideas knows, the customer is always right.

    —> That’s why Linux comes in many different distributions

    With regards to the soap parts, advertisement play a very big role in promoting a product, not just how it performs. Magaling ngang magtanggal ng mantsa, hindi naman kilala sa merkado, wala ding silbi. Ten years pa bago makilala yung product.

    I could go on and on, but the same mantra of marketing is applicable to any product, service, or idea competing in an open arena. Consumers, consumers, and consumers rule.

    —> This has already been established eons ago.

    Buyers might not do research – they can’t be bothered to do that – they just don’t buy again if the product they bought didn’t deliver. A product is only as good as the last experience.

    —> Pero nagtatanong pa rin ang mga tao kung ano ang magandang bilhin, ano ang maayos at hindi, ano ang masarap, etc. Kapag hindi gumana yung product, they ask why.

    So I wouldn’t knock Ms. Fudolig for her message. Demeaning her for “not doing research” or “not being an expert” is in bad taste. (She doesn’t demean people for not being able to get a “2.0” or higher in Physics or Math, or who can’t write a scientific paper, or who are still in college at 17.)

    —> Neither do I, or anyone I know for that matter. And not being an expert – she said that herself.

    If she did her “research”, she wouldn’t have been an expert consumer.

    —> How do you define an expert consumer? Ang nakukuha ko kasi dito, being an expert consumer is not knowing anything about the product. So kapag nagresearch ako about a product, Am I a novice consumer?

    By the way, is anyone thinking of software which are friendly to older people? Older people have money to pay for convenience and ease of use. I know. I am old. Truly.

    —> Yes. Andyan ang accessibility options

    Consumers vs IT geeks and nangyayari… So geeks are not consumers? Are you saying na hanggang ganyan na lang ang consumers? Napaka-pragmatic naman.

  11. On Miki:

    Kiddo, masasabi ko lang talaga is next time pag may offer sayo pag isipan mong mabuti. In the first place sana na foresee mo na to. Mejo nabother nga ako kase eto lang ung topic sa Y4IT na negative ung dating [Windows vs Linux]. And kid, promise you gotta try fresh breeds of Linux right now. Ive been a linux user for nine months palang and i LOVE it to the point that it is incomparable to my eight years of passionless-ly using Windows

  12. Teka lang – the organizers proposed several topics to Ms. Fudolig but she CHOSE her topic.

  13. What I am saying is: if someone touted to be very bright couldn’t get such a simple thing to work, then there may be a problem.

    Heck, I got an old Red Hat Linux to work. Once. Took me two hours, no manual, you see. Why indeed, couldn’t a celebrated brain do it? Because maybe, just maybe, it’s not her thing. And maybe, just maybe, there are millions there who can’t get it to work either.

    By the way, I happen to know that Ms. Fudolig was invited, not “offered” to speak (fyi, speaking engagements are a favor to the organizers, especially when done for free), and she REFUSED on the basis that SHE IS NOT INTO I.T.. Ask the organizers how they got her to speak at all.

    That’s it, guys, I’m out of here.

  14. What I am saying is: if someone touted to be very bright couldn’t get such a simple thing to work, then there may be a problem.

    >> If such is the case (and taking your words as it is) then those who can make it work is above “very bright”? Just because she can not get it, does not mean that everyone else will not get it. You regard human intelligence as linear and hierarchical. She may not get it, but others potentially can. But having read what happened (basing my judgments upon rosmant’s post, I am not a first-hand witness to the event) her talk may just have circumvented the possibility of other people trying it out (thus not having their potential realized). Do note, that other people do see her credibility and with this credibility lies her responsibility, as a speaker, to present the subject matter as impartial as she is able to. This includes (but not limited to) gathering *up-to-date* data.

    Heck, I got an old Red Hat Linux to work. Once. Took me two hours, no manual, you see. Why indeed, couldn’t a celebrated brain do it? Because maybe, just maybe, it’s not her thing. And maybe, just maybe, there are millions there who can’t get it to work either.

    >> The operative word here is “old”. Define old? Because in the world of Linux, a version can be considered old in less than a year. And besides, is Red Hat all that you have tried? How did you come about to choosing Red Hat? Or did you associate Red Hat with Linux thinking that this is all there is to Linux? One of the strong points of Linux is that you are given a *choice*. It is always folly to assume that [insert distro here] is all that there is to Linux.

    By the way, I happen to know that Ms. Fudolig was invited, not “offered” to speak (fyi, speaking engagements are a favor to the organizers, especially when done for free), and she REFUSED on the basis that SHE IS NOT INTO I.T.. Ask the organizers how they got her to speak at all.

    >> Even then, she still bears the burden of a speaker. She still needs to present the subject matter in a relatively impartial standpoint, even when her stand is from within the consumers POV because she chose to be a speaker. Yes, even when she was persuaded to be a speaker, she still gave consent.
    Edit: having read what Y4IT geek posted, if that being true, then more so did she have to bear the obligation as a speaker.

    That’s it, guys, I’m out of here.
    >> I do hope that you are leaving here without contempt. A lot of us that has posted their comments are merely trying to make a point across because we feel that there has been an injustice done. Only that some of us are more hostile in methodology than others. It is not in our interest to demean Ms Mikaela Fudolig for we do not gain or derive any pleasure or incentive from it.

    For everyone else that is reading, I suggest reading and reflecting upon this before you readily reply.

    this: http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm

  15. What I am saying is: if someone touted to be very bright couldn’t get such a simple thing to work, then there may be a problem.

    —> Wow, so Mikaela Fudolig is our benchmark for brightness now? I beg to disagree. How very narcissistic.

    Heck, I got an old Red Hat Linux to work. Once. Took me two hours, no manual, you see. Why indeed, couldn’t a celebrated brain do it? Because maybe, just maybe, it’s not her thing.

    —> And now you contradict yourself. Tsk, tsk, tsk. How illogical. I personally don’t care whether she, or should I say her brain, is one of the most celebrated ones in this time, and a lot of people would agree with me on that.

    And maybe, just maybe, there are millions there who can’t get it to work either.

    —> And maybe, just maybe, there are millions there who CAN help those who can’t get it to work too.

    By the way, I happen to know that Ms. Fudolig was invited, not “offered” to speak (fyi, speaking engagements are a favor to the organizers, especially when done for free), and she REFUSED on the basis that SHE IS NOT INTO I.T.. Ask the organizers how they got her to speak at all.

    —> The point is that she accepted the offer, whether she liked it or not. Dun pa lang nagkaroon na s’ya ng responsibilidad bilang tagapagsalita.

    That’s it, guys, I’m out of here.

    —> -.– — ..- .—-. .-.. .-.. / -… . / -… .- -.-. -.- .-.-.- / .. / -.- -. — .– .-.-.-

  16. It’s an opinion speech! I do agree that she’s not an expert on this field, but she should have the right to voice her opinion. While she may not speak for linux users, she speaks for many of us windows users who share her experiences.

  17. Kung ikaw ba ang magsasalita sa harap ng maraming tao, handa ka bang akuin ang responsibilidad bilang speaker? Yes, it’s her opinion, but she is a person that other people consider to be in authority (given her credentials). Kung minura kita sa harap ng, let’s say 5000 people, and I say that what I said was my opinion, okay lang ba yun para sa iyo (given that I have the right to voice my opinion)?

  18. Why was the talk/topic allowed and included even if Microsoft was a major sponsor. It was rubbish!

  19. guys plis bakit kailangang maging ganito usapan nyo palagi? It’s her opinion leave it at that.. let’s take the things we said and let’s use it to better Linux.. oo nakasanayan nya yun pero ano pa? talaga namang nauna sa GUI ang windows so by default syempre yung ang ‘bar’ ang basehan.. if we really want people to use Linux hindi ganito ang paraan.. lalo tayong tinitingnan na masama nito eh.. kasi naman ‘hard reset’ palagi ang gusto natin.. switch.. switch ..switch.. iba iba ang tao… iba iba ang gusto.. hindi pare pareho.,. iba iba ang problema may kanya kanyang solusyon.. instead of trying to make everybody switch to each others side.. cant we just get along? interoperate? ako gamit ko windows pero open office pinapatakbo ko.. mas marami nga nagpapatakbo ng open office sa windows eh.. aminin na natin.. marami pa tayong kakaining bigas with regards to linux on the desktop.. pero look sa backend.. walang tatalo sa LAMP. Linux and Open Source will never prosper kung puro away at pataasan tayo ng ihi. unless we show it based on the merits.. wala.. walang katapusang debate. Respetuhin nyo naman si Mikki.. wla namang ginwang masama yung tao.. nirerespeto rin naman tayo ng mga windows user eh.. masyado ng religious ang usapan na ito.. pabayaan nalang natin ang mga tao sa gusto nilang gamitin.. pag makita nila at nagustuhan ang linux eh di tenk yu! Kung hind eh ok.. magkaibigan at tao at pilipino pa rin naman tayo.. hindi naman tayo magpapakasal sa isat isa na kailangan nating mag convert ng religion..

  20. Hi mas old na fogey,

    guys plis bakit kailangang maging ganito usapan nyo palagi? It’s her opinion leave it at that..
    >> No one says its not her opinion. However, regardless of what her opinion is, I and other I believe think that we concern ourselves more with the talk than her opinions.

    let’s take the things we said and let’s use it to better Linux.. oo nakasanayan nya yun pero ano pa? talaga namang nauna sa GUI ang windows so by default syempre yung ang ‘bar’ ang basehan..
    >> Yes, if you search the net you can see that these things are already being implemented, so you can’t say that developers are not hearing out the rest of the consumers. And it is Apple who first implemented GUI in their consumer products. Yes we know that Windows is the viewed standard of usability, but is it a reason to conclude that Linux is not usable?

    if we really want people to use Linux hindi ganito ang paraan.. lalo tayong tinitingnan na masama nito eh.. kasi naman ‘hard reset’ palagi ang gusto natin.. switch.. switch ..switch.. iba iba ang tao… iba iba ang gusto.. hindi pare pareho.,. iba iba ang problema may kanya kanyang solusyon.. instead of trying to make everybody switch to each others side.. cant we just get along? interoperate? ako gamit ko windows pero open office pinapatakbo ko.. mas marami nga nagpapatakbo ng open office sa windows eh.. aminin na natin.. marami pa tayong kakaining bigas with regards to linux on the desktop.. pero look sa backend.. walang tatalo sa LAMP.
    >> Hmmm, I never indicated nor implied in previous posts that I want people to switch to Linux NOW. Nor am I convincing them to switch. I clarified my point in my latest post. I am not bashing Windows nor saying to people that “hey, switch to Windows now!”

    Linux and Open Source will never prosper kung puro away at pataasan tayo ng ihi. unless we show it based on the merits.. wala.. walang katapusang debate.
    >> Hmmmm, that is why we convince people through argumentation. Because a lot of people judge the book by its cover. It is never my intention to debate on the merits of Linux over Windows. But I would only point out the truth about Linux. If people couldn’t understand that, then problems do arise.

    Respetuhin nyo naman si Mikki.. wla namang ginwang masama yung tao.. nirerespeto rin naman tayo ng mga windows user eh.. masyado ng religious ang usapan na ito.. pabayaan nalang natin ang mga tao sa gusto nilang gamitin.. pag makita nila at nagustuhan ang linux eh di tenk yu! Kung hind eh ok.. magkaibigan at tao at pilipino pa rin naman tayo.. hindi naman tayo magpapakasal sa isat isa na kailangan nating mag convert ng religion..
    >> Yes, many people have demeaned Mikki here. I would like to point out that the validity and reliability of her talk has nothing to do with her intelligence nor personality.

    Regards,
    rosmant

  21. To mas old na fogey

    Nobody here is saying “switch to Linux, period”. When my friends ask me to reformat their laptops and install the OS, I ask them if they would like to try out Linux. If they liked it pero gusto din nila ng Windows, I could also install Windows – dual boot na. Kung ayaw nila, okay lang. Pero I do install open source software sa mga PC at laptop nila. And guess what? They like it. Kung ayaw nila mag-Linux, okay lang din. It’s a matter of preference naman kasi e. HINDI HARD RESET.

    Mind you, hindi lahat ng nagpropromote ng Linux at Windows ay laging nagpapataasan ng ihi. Pag ginawa nila yun, mababasa lang sila ng sarili nilang ihi. Ang PC ko sa bahay naka-dual boot. XP at Mint. At nag-eenjoy akong gamitin parehas.

    Nobody is disrespecting her, at least intentionally. Kung yun ang tingin ng iba, masyado lang siguro nilang pinepersonal yung thread na ito.

  22. Damage is already done my friends. Let us look forward.

    My recommendation to correct the damage is this. To the Linux community most especially in UP Diliman, let us join forces (and I hope you’ll agree with me) to extend our services to help Ms Fudolig with Linux and Open source applications. Let us start afresh with introducing her to the wonderful possibilities that it has to offer. The product of the reintroduction is another review of the Linux experience from Ms Fudolig, published on a public media, sponsored by the Linux community. If after the re-introduction she feels that Linux is still not for her then at least we can say we gave it a fight.

    Should Ms Fudolig accept then just tell us when and where and we will be there. No animosity, only the intent to help and share our knowledge.

  23. TO STIKIFLEM:
    Don’t grill naman.. 🙂 About the RAM requirement, it’s a fact .. In terms of usability, how can we really define “usability”? Too broad. For me, I’m on Linux. Because, I can see, its the most usable incentive among all the OS nearest to the usability of Mac and Microsoft if we will look on its availability for everyone. (All OS can be an incentive by the way..) It can be use by all. By the Poor to rich. By the lowest existing ram to the 1gb ram. By the latest lowest and oldest kind of PC to the latest newest PC. Yun ang alam kong definition ng usability. Tama ba? I mean, did you get my point? Correct me if I’m wrong.

    TO MIKAELA FUDOLIG:
    Hi kid. 🙂 I know I may be not even a toe of your intellect but we are not of the same nature of experiences, right? You may know a range of issue regarding how Microsoft is to a mass of certain people but maybe, I may know more of it. Maybe Neo, Rosmant, Stikiflem, NightFox, Dayg, Old Fogey Nerd, Y4it geek, Kxesporlas, Drag, Leklek, Joshua and company (even me and you), may know a certain point of view regarding its related issues based on how all these things affect and may affect us. Windows is such a good OS. I was wrong when I said I used Microsoft since I was in Grade 6. After so much realization, I had used Microsoft pala since I was 5 where my uncle sent me a computer from Middle East Asia with Microsoft as it’s OS but to my regret, I only remembered that I was playing on that PC when all of a sudden, it failed to keep its pace on my machine. Well, I can read by that time. I can even install it with my diskette my uncle gave me. I cannot say I am a computer geek by that experience but I remembered I formatted it 3 times and gave way to Mac which I threw the monitor up. After all, it’s totally different from microsoft for me at that time. I stopped at 8. I forgot all about it. Well, lucky for me learning how to install that stuffs at a very young age. I could still remember how it looked when a virus infected my PC. 🙂 anyway, Microsoft touched my bytes again after a computer subject in Grade 4. At Grade 6, steadily, I’m on to the Microsoft again. Until this year. Until I got my laptop. XP na ang ginagamit ko. Wow! Evolution. But it crashes from 3-8 times a day whenever I open Adobe Photoshop. I tried Vista. You know. Vista made from Shopping Center. LOL. Why not the genuine one? First, it’s a perfect clone of Vista, applications and preferences from the genuine can be also present in there. Second, I cannot spare thousands of peso if I am not sure if it will satisfy me. Third, too expensive. (Yeah, I bought laptop because I need it badly. It’s a second hand laptop with very good specs: HP Compaq.) I am poor. Pwede naman siguro magkalaptop ang poor. Mahabang kwento how I got that. Back to the topic. So, I was on Vista. It really satisfied my eyes’ hunger but no ease at all. It crashes a lot. From 3-8 crashes a day I had before, turned out 3-8 crashes every time I turn it on. I formatted my laptop many times that came to the point that all my mercy was on my laptop that it cannot manage to handle vista though its VISTAble. My laptop has high specs but how can’t vista run smoothly on it. Until I got Linux. Honestly, I was not fond of it. Parang No choice ba. But I was wrong. Three days of first time using it, I cooled me down. No crashes at all. Up to now, it only crashes when it overheats. (because it’s of AMD Turion64) And it’s usable in terms of ease, no crashes, graphics – everything.
    You know, it’s just adaptation that only matters. Minsan may mga nangyayari like nasanay ka sa isang bagay and you wanna try this new thing nearly the same with what you’re previously using. It’s natural for you to expect a perfect clone of what you previously use with the new one. Parang Microsoft at Linux. Nasanay ka sa Microsoft and maybe you’ve heard about Linux and gave it a try. But kid, remember. Mac is Mac. Microsoft is Microsoft. Linux is Linux. They aren’t the same. They were never. Some of their controls might be familiar but they aren’t the same with regards to its menus, preferences, start-ups. And being different to Microsoft and gives you a hard time with its content is not really right to say “It’s not usable” or “It’s not user friendly”. The point here is “YOU HAVEN’T EXPLORED it’s world.” I know you know that EXPERIENCE is the best teacher. Got it Mikki?

    Let’s review your statement here: (BTW, Please read my comment at a normal voice. Di ako galit. As if I am talking to my sister.)

    “Hello, Rosmant!
    My name is Mikaela Fudolig, and you were just talking about me. I don’t know what the fuss is all about.”
    __Kid, you should know what you have entered. It’s a very controversial issue and it’s not just a big thing but a gigantic thing. And I know you know what’s the fuss all about.

    “ My point is that, if Linux were so usable, WHY AREN’T MOST PEOPLE SHIFTING TO IT, despite its potential?”
    __Kid, most of the people don’t know of it. You see why some of the people commented here in Rosmant’s page is you gave a negative outlook of Linux based on your experience. It’s easy to say, “Panget yan. Na-try ko na yan.” Mikki, alam mo mahirap pag nagbitiw ka ng salitang parang ganun. Diba? Alam mo, kahit opinion lang yan, it’s threatening. It may come out as a generalization na. Quote and unquote. “Generalization”. Oo, opinion mo, I’m sticking to it but see this. Kung friends tayo at nakagamit ka na ng cellphone na gusto kong itry. Syempre, magtatanong muna ko sayo dahil ikaw yung may experience na. Let’s say:
    : “Mikki, Ok ba yung N95? Para kasing gusto ko mag Nokia. Luma na kasi Sony ericsson ko.”
    /o>: “Ah yun? Nakagamit na ko nun. Pero di ko nagustuhan yung specs. Di sya usable. Masyadong maraming menus. Sony Ericsson padin ang maganda.”
    : “Talaga? O sige. Thanks ha. Kung ikaw nahirapan sa paggamit nun, panu pa ko diba? Sayang lang sa pera. Halika, Trinoma tayo.”
    /o>: “Wag dun. Masakit sa ulo. Andaming pasikot-sikot. Nakakapagod. Sa SM North na lang tayo. Mas kabisado ko pa.”
    Mikki, sample dialogue lang ‘to. Based on experience not just from me but from a lot of people, opinion can be a strong generalization. Lalo na, you are a celebrated brain. Pwedeng isipin ng mga nakikinig sayo na, “Si Mikki, napakatalino. Nahihirapan sa Linux, panu pa kong mas konti ang alam.” Diba, Miks? Pwedeng ganun diba? Ang hirap maging speaker sa mga ganyan diba? Lalo na kung opinion ang pag-uusapan. Kasi opinion mo yung naririnig nila. Panu yung opinion ng iba na para sa kanila usable ang Linux. Kasi, yung opinion is just based on you. Limited lang resources na mula sayo na malaki ang epekto sa karamihan. Microsoft client ka at halos lahat ng delegates ay microsoft client. They may take part behalf of you kasi Miks, being a speaker is not just being a speaker lang. Hindi ka lang basta-basta kinukuha kung saan. Kumbaga, manggagaling sa isang special na tao yung sasabihin o yung magiging laman ng program. At malaki ang relasyon ng pagiging speaker sa mga sasabihin mo. Kasi, tignan mo ha. Tayong dalawa, kung tayo ang pagpipilian bilang speaker sa event na yun, mas pipiliin ka nila. Kasi, may character ka sa public. At di ka lang basta isang bata or estudyante. Isa kang prof at a very young age.
    Mac. Di ba pag bibili ka ng Mac, may mga short lessons pa pagkabili mo? Kasi iba ng Mac. Lalo na kung Microsoft user ka, iba ang Mac lalo na sa key settings, configuration, commands, menus – halos lahat. Sa Linux din, iba. Kaya lang kasi, libre ang Linux. Di natin sila pwedeng obligahin na, “Oh ayan kumuha ako ng Linux. Kelangan turuan nila ako dito.” Pwede tayong magtanong. Pwede natin diskubrihin. Alam mo kung anong tinuro sakin ng Linux, “Identification”. “Identify what may be is missing. Identify how to configure. Identify how to run it.” Alam mo, hindi lang nagbibigay ng service ang Linux. May mga values pa nga to na tinuturo. Getting religious with it, it’s for everybody. Leaving you to be independent and exploratory. At ikaw pa ang bahalang mag manage how it will come for you. Pwede mo pang iba-ibahin.
    Usable ang Linux. Kundi siya usable, wala na malamang ang gumagamit nun diba? Malamang mga IT geeks lang ang nakakagamit nun. Ako di naman ako IT geek. Usable siya para sakin. Siguro, kulang lang sa adaptation si Miks or maybe, she wasn’t introduced yet to the world of Linux. Siguro Mikki, wala pa sa introduction yung pinapakita sayo ng Linux. Alam mo, marami ka pang di nakikita, I bet. 🙂

    “Maybe it’s because IT experts refuse to listen to buyers, who are NOT IT geeks.”
    __Kahit “maybe” siya, you are definitely wrong. Alam mo, nung first day ko sa Linux, from the simplest question to the most complicated possible question, nasagot nila. Alam mo dati, di ako nauubusan ng tanong. Pero lahat may sagot. Ngayon, parang di ako nauubusan ng sagot. Di pa Nagtatanong, may sagot na. Or di pa man sakin sumasagi ang isang certain possibile question, may sagot na. It only begins when you became aware of Linux. They listen. The matter is masyadong judgemental agad ang clients. Di sila nagtatanong. Judge na lang ng judge. At the first sight pa lang, judge na. Linux is flexible. Broad. Foundation pa nga lang para sakin ang initial appearance ng Linux, pagkainstall niya sa laptop ko. Kung panu siya naging complicated ngayon, as in super complicated and complex, its because I configured it for myself.

    “Regarding my speaking on the topic, I did not pretend to be an IT expert — I had said that in the beginning of my talk, and I had informed the organizers about that. All I wanted to do was to share something from the outside of the IT expert’s world that perhaps, they do not see.”
    __We know that Mikki. Naiintindihan kita. And you know what? 🙂 I wanted to share (Sana. Kung pwede nga lang eh.) something outside the seemingly Non-IT experts’ world that perhaps, you might haven’t seen yet – from a NON-IT expert’s experience. 🙂

    And regarding Firefox, and whether it is freeware or not, that is not my point. What I said was that Linux could be another Firefox, if only developers listened to what the non-IT experts (which comprise majority of the world) need. I didn’t think that hurt.
    __Mikki, may tanong ako. How would developers listen to what the non-IT experts need if these non-IT experts don’t ask? Hindi ganun kadali mag-figure out ng gusto ng mga clients KUNG ang naririnig ng developers ay “bakit ganyan, bakit ganito, bakit ganun?” instead of “paano ‘to, paano yan?, what if ganito, what if ganyan?” and the like. And I also didn’t think that hurt.

    “Regarding familiarity, isn’t that one aspect of usability”
    __No, it isn’t. It’s another factor.

    “Thus, if Linux became more familiar, wouldn’t people find it easier to shift to it?”
    __How familiar ba ito Mikki? 🙂 Medyo naguluhan kasi ako. Kasi, kung familiar as “Windows”, I think it’s not applicable. Familiar siya in the sense na OS siya na may programs at applications. Parang Mac at Windows. May programs and application. Kung tutuusin, kung “windows baby” ka, as in windows lang. Mas magagamit mo ang Linux kaysa sa Mac. Ako nabwisit ako sa Mac. Pero tulad nga ng sabi ko, its just a matter of adaptation. Mac yun at hindi siya Windows or Linux. I just familiarized myself with it. Marunong naman ako magbasa at alam ko ang ibig sabihin ng mga salita na nasa Mac. Kaya magagamit ko siya. “Usable” ‘ika nga. User-friendly siya kasi specific naman lahat ng commands niya.

    “Linux could still be better – it has not yet reached its peak.”
    __Yun nga yung hindi ko alam eh. 🙂 Akala ko the best na yun ng Linux. Hindi pa pala. LOL. Parang Introduction palang pala yun. Hahahahah!

    “I hope this clarifies things.”
    __I hope I clarified also a little of your clarification. 🙂

    TO OLD_FOGEY_NERD:
    “What I am saying is: if someone touted to be very bright couldn’t get such a simple thing to work, then there may be a problem.”
    __Di naman iikot ang mundo para sa iisang tao. Hindi gagana ang isang OS ayon sa gusto ng iisang tao o iilang tao lang. A developer develops an OS not for 1/3 of the world population but for all.

    “Heck, I got an old Red Hat Linux to work. Once. Took me two hours, no manual, you see.”
    __You contradicted yourself. And di lang Red Hat Linux ang nag-eexist. Di mo pa ba nata try yung iba. >.< It’s not just Red Hat Linux.
    It’s not just Ubuntu.
    It’s not just Mandrake.
    It’s not just Mandriva.
    It’s not just Edubuntu.
    It’s not just Xubuntu.
    It’s not just Mythbuntu.
    It’s not just Kubuntu.
    It’s not just LinuxMint.
    It’s not just Ubuntu Studio.
    It’s not just Open Suse.
    There’s not just Ubuntu Muslim Edition.
    There’s not just Ubuntu Christian Edition.
    There’s not just Bayanihan Linux.
    There’s not just Linux Workbench.
    But there’s a lot more you’ve ever think.

    “Why indeed, couldn’t a celebrated brain do it? Because maybe, just maybe, it’s not her thing. And maybe, just maybe, there are millions there who can’t get it to work either.”
    __Neo answered it already: “And maybe, just maybe, there are millions there who CAN help those who can’t get it to work too.”

    “That’s it, guys, I’m out of here.”
    __Are you trying to escape or what? Facts are the things you can’t really contradict.

    TO LEKLEK:
    “It’s an opinion speech! I do agree that she’s not an expert on this field, but she should have the right to voice her opinion.”
    __Tulad nga ng sinabi ko, opinions voiced out in front of 5000 delegates should be delivered carefully and thought of a million times. Dahil opinion nga lang yun. Na pwedeng maging minor generalization. Hindi natin kontrolado ang isip ng audience. Pwede din nilang isipin na fact ang opinion. Lalu na kung intimidation ang mangunguna. “Pwede nila sabihin na, Ah. Taga-UP yan. Matalino yan. Alam niya kung tama ang karamihan sa mga bagay.” Nag-survey kami sa iba’t-ibang universities with 100 respondents each entitled “A non-UP student’s perspective towards a UP student’s words”. Lumalabas na 8 out of 10 non-UP Student, ganun ang pananaw. Basta sinabi ng taga-UP na ganun, ganito, ganyan, they instantly believe in it. Panu pa yung Visayan and Mindanao Universities? Sana nga di nila alam na nag eexist ang UP para hindi sila naiintimidate ng ganun.

    “While she may not speak for linux users, she speaks for many of us windows users who share her experiences.”
    __I may not speak for windows users who have experiences of disappointments towards Linux such as of Mikki but I speak for many of the windows users who are disappointed and greatly disappointed towards Windows’ performance and for the windows users who experienced Linux already. Got it?

    TO ROYAL FLARE:
    __Well, I obviously agree on you. Ang point lang ng argument is “Linux is not usable” voiced out in thousands of delegates. Not “Which is the better OS?” or, “Don’t use Linux or Microsoft” or the like. As for Mikki, alam kong hindi sya narrowminded at alam kong alam niya ang dapat niyang gawin.

    TO MAS OLD NA FOGEY:
    I was thinking of Mom ka kaya ni Mikki?
    I respect Mikki. We just want to cite some facts and our opinions. Sana you do the same. Irespeto niyo opinion namin. We accept what might our side’s weaknesses at kung may mali man we stand corrected. Sana ganun din yung iba. If that’s the fact then let it be. Not building other defense mechanism which broadens the argument kung ayaw niyo na ganito na kalawak yung sinasakop ng argument. And hindi naman siguro to gawa-gawa lang ni rosmant for the pleasure for argument or debate. This argument actually showed a lot of unrevealed facts and opinions not just from the Linux users but from the windows users and other windows users who had experiences already with Linux. Diba napansin natin, iba-iba. At from that different citations, maraming conclusions tayong nabubuo.
    I never heard naman na somebody said, “Boo MikKi! You’re wrong! You’re wrong! Loser. Boo Mikki! You’re so ignorant.” Nothing too personal for Mikki, right? Napaka gentle pa nga nung iba kung magsalita. We are not shooting Mikki by the way. We are just on what she said. Not her.

    AS FOR EVERYONE:
    We are just citing premises that may support the conclusions arisen from Mikki’s statement at the Y4IT and therefore, proving that the argument is valid. For if it will remain invalid, all the premises provided by the different persons here will all be invalid. And talking about these things will all be nonsense. If this doesn’t make sense to you, then why cite yours. Give and Take lang. Aminin natin, may natutunan tayo. And about the Linux’ weaknesses, I strongly admit it. Imperfections teach developers how to improve Linux. And also for Microsoft.

  24. to royalflare:

    hello living legend! =)

  25. @parabola’s philosophy

    “TO ROYAL FLARE:
    __Well, I obviously agree on you. Ang point lang ng argument is “Linux is not usable” voiced out in thousands of delegates. Not “Which is the better OS?” or, “Don’t use Linux or Microsoft” or the like. As for Mikki, alam kong hindi sya narrowminded at alam kong alam niya ang dapat niyang gawin.”

    Your right. The main intent of my proposal is to solve two problems
    1) the negative impact of the initial review
    2) Mikki’s experienced setbacks with Linux.

    It would be sad not to do a follow-through on a problem and most especially not to find any sort of closure for it. The scientist in Mikki should very well be acquainted with this feeling.

    @neo
    parang kilala na kita. hahaha! Hi next legend!

  26. ROYAL FLARE:
    Yeah. Thanks for pointing out Ate. 😀

    NEO:
    I know you na WB.. 😀

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